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Geothermal Designs Arise as a Stormproof Resource

nytimes.com -- Advocates for geothermal energy say that the path of destruction cut by Hurricane Sandy, which unearthed fuel tanks, ravaged cooling towers and battered air-conditioners, has already persuaded some building owners to switch to geothermal systems that use underground pipes to harness the earth’s energy for heating and cooling buildings.

“We’re seeing dozens of these half-empty and empty oil tanks just popping up all over the place in the flooded areas”..

“Those tanks become buoyant in all that water,” he said. But since geothermal systems don’t use fossil fuels or mechanical systems that are exposed to the elements, Mr. Reardon said, he started fielding calls from people asking for estimates on geothermal systems just days after the storm. “Often it’s a case where they were considerin

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Submitted Nov 09, 2012 By: teafortwo

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NedW Champion Author Indianapolis Posts:5,599 Points:1,139,320 Joined:Mar 2008	Message Posted: Nov 11, 2012 2:14:13 AM Ignore NedW Report Abuse I wonder if heat can be pumped up from the earth's upper mantle cost effectively. Nah.
pulpwood Champion Author Mississippi Posts:7,379 Points:1,859,605 Joined:Sep 2006	Message Posted: Nov 11, 2012 1:44:33 AM Ignore pulpwood Report Abuse good if you can afford it.
Eugenian Champion Author Oregon Posts:1,847 Points:359,205 Joined:Oct 2009	Message Posted: Nov 10, 2012 7:01:25 AM Ignore Eugenian Report Abuse Geothermal = free energy (after the non-trivial expense of drilling the well). Why are we not doing this on a huge scale?
MAC48 Champion Author Dallas Posts:1,546 Points:764,095 Joined:Dec 2006	Message Posted: Nov 10, 2012 3:22:17 AM Ignore MAC48 Report Abuse Geothermal cooling has been utilized by various civilizations for thousands of years as evidenced by the caves and caverns that have been used and are still being used to grow mushrooms, cure wines, cure cheeses, etcetera at a constant temperature of about 68 degrees. For residential purposes, all a geothermal heat pump does is force the exchange of air in a structure for the air that is in pipes or conduit running through a deep well/wells or a series of very narrow and long U shaped connected covered trenches. The air that is brought back into the structure is conditioned air which is approximately at the desired temperature for cooling purposes in the warmer months having passed through cold water (wells) or cool earth ( covered trenches). Simultaneously the exhaust air is moved into the pipe or conduit system to be cooled in turn. Most geothermal heat pump installations also require a secondary heating source, normally electric resistance heat, to bring the air that emerges from the pipes or conduit up to the desired comfort level of say 70 or 72 degrees to provide warm air during the colder months. In any case, geothermal installations require electricity to run the heat pump year around and to provide the additional air heating needed in cold months which means a standby generator is needed when the regular source of electricity is disrupted. Do not confuse a standard heat pump system with a geothermal heat pump system since they are really different applications. Standard heat pumps exchange structure air for outside air where as a geothermal heat pump uses the coolness of the ground beneath the surface several feet or in well water to cool recirculated structure air.
Pramodsharma Champion Author Richmond Posts:1,969 Points:384,915 Joined:Feb 2012	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 10:26:44 PM Ignore Pramodsharma Report Abuse and I am still not understanding what Geothermal Engineering is?
PDQBlues Champion Author San Diego Posts:7,059 Points:1,445,400 Joined:Jan 2009	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:05:31 PM Ignore PDQBlues Report Abuse California has several geothermal plants, and they all seem to work quite well.
sydb7 Champion Author Atlanta Posts:3,547 Points:1,917,055 Joined:Mar 2003	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 4:43:27 PM Ignore sydb7 Report Abuse This is an alternate source that needs to be looked into!
evowner Champion Author Salem Posts:2,167 Points:356,335 Joined:May 2012	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 1:13:17 PM Ignore evowner Report Abuse Technology has been around over a century.
CocoPaz Champion Author Santa Barbara Posts:2,360 Points:320,470 Joined:Jun 2012	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 12:40:40 PM Ignore CocoPaz Report Abuse Now THIS sounds interesting. We are praying for those of you on the East Coast.
geezrtek Champion Author Michigan Posts:1,891 Points:429,560 Joined:Apr 2011	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 11:48:16 AM Ignore geezrtek Report Abuse Let a hundred flowers bloom.
skinsfan125 Champion Author Virginia Posts:1,549 Points:280,490 Joined:Jul 2010	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 11:27:48 AM Ignore skinsfan125 Report Abuse good
ModelWarships Champion Author Missouri Posts:5,779 Points:1,229,160 Joined:Jul 2008	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 10:44:10 AM Ignore ModelWarships Report Abuse yuck
tutaw Champion Author Kentucky Posts:3,585 Points:839,820 Joined:Sep 2008	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 10:39:49 AM Ignore tutaw Report Abuse makes sense
Tutootin Champion Author Toronto Posts:10,106 Points:3,074,505 Joined:Jun 2004	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 10:26:38 AM Ignore Tutootin Report Abuse mitchells, Great information. Thanks!
Sethyl Champion Author Miami Posts:1,738 Points:374,540 Joined:Oct 2009	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 10:26:25 AM Ignore Sethyl Report Abuse test it on a small scale
bar1035 Champion Author Charlotte Posts:9,135 Points:1,295,195 Joined:Aug 2006	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 10:13:05 AM Ignore bar1035 Report Abuse See the packards42 comment for a price check
40mpgsaturn Champion Author Wisconsin Posts:2,480 Points:518,380 Joined:Jun 2011	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 10:09:06 AM Ignore 40mpgsaturn Report Abuse You would still need a generator or back-up batteries.
ss70 Champion Author Detroit Posts:9,639 Points:1,867,175 Joined:Sep 2005	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 10:06:07 AM Ignore ss70 Report Abuse It is toooooo expensive .
mattymattmatt All-Star Author Scranton Posts:889 Points:362,590 Joined:Mar 2011	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 10:02:37 AM Ignore mattymattmatt Report Abuse ok.
truckpdlr Champion Author Tucson Posts:2,940 Points:1,093,290 Joined:Sep 2009	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:59:05 AM Ignore truckpdlr Report Abuse OK
dopster Champion Author Toledo Posts:7,257 Points:2,289,325 Joined:Aug 2004	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:58:49 AM Ignore dopster Report Abuse Our geothermal resources should be taken more seriously.
scooterbug1 Rookie Author Tennessee Posts:28 Points:3,985 Joined:Jul 2012	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:55:14 AM Ignore scooterbug1 Report Abuse geothermal is not being taken seriously JMO
zimowski Champion Author San Jose Posts:6,656 Points:1,581,540 Joined:Nov 2007	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:55:04 AM Ignore zimowski Report Abuse Not a good idea in earthquake zones.
packards42 Champion Author Washington Posts:6,430 Points:1,125,665 Joined:Feb 2005	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:54:45 AM Ignore packards42 Report Abuse We check out Geothermal systems and the price was 6 times high efficiency heatpumps.
STLcardsfan Champion Author St. Louis Posts:1,039 Points:1,371,960 Joined:Apr 2006	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:53:18 AM Ignore STLcardsfan Report Abuse See if it pans out
Diesel_Ram Champion Author Dallas Posts:6,487 Points:1,515,535 Joined:Jan 2009	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:51:15 AM Ignore Diesel_Ram Report Abuse Dosen't seem like anything new?
Kato51 Champion Author Atlanta Posts:7,250 Points:2,161,840 Joined:Jul 2005	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:51:08 AM Ignore Kato51 Report Abuse Interesting. Why not give it a try.
BillHeatherL Champion Author Alberta Posts:7,628 Points:1,921,705 Joined:Apr 2007	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:49:37 AM Ignore BillHeatherL Report Abuse geothermal systems have been around a long time
Hangnail309 Champion Author Manitoba Posts:6,009 Points:1,674,255 Joined:Aug 2006	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:49:31 AM Ignore Hangnail309 Report Abuse this system still relies on the electrical grid for power to operate.
peanutsMN Champion Author Twin Cities Posts:1,674 Points:383,980 Joined:Jul 2011	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:48:22 AM Ignore peanutsMN Report Abuse And needs electricity to run.
gasman50 Champion Author Portland Posts:8,829 Points:2,406,560 Joined:Nov 2005	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:47:47 AM Ignore gasman50 Report Abuse time will tell.......
doncNJ Champion Author New Jersey Posts:7,506 Points:1,502,170 Joined:Oct 2008	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:47:05 AM Ignore doncNJ Report Abuse Do you remember dome homes?
dm9667_23 Champion Author Pennsylvania Posts:1,203 Points:349,970 Joined:May 2008	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:45:31 AM Ignore dm9667_23 Report Abuse interesting
jimgraham Champion Author Akron Posts:10,360 Points:1,977,220 Joined:Oct 2007	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:45:21 AM Ignore jimgraham Report Abuse And the savings keep on coming - till the electric goes off. Unless you have a backup power supply for the pumps and fans.
MrLuigi Champion Author Massachusetts Posts:4,758 Points:963,760 Joined:Jun 2005	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:44:44 AM Ignore MrLuigi Report Abuse Geothermal is a very neat concept, saw a program on tv about it, would love to have it!
rasprout Champion Author Tacoma Posts:3,367 Points:1,218,935 Joined:Jun 2009	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:44:38 AM Ignore rasprout Report Abuse Interesting...
speedraider Champion Author Orlando Posts:3,658 Points:1,641,970 Joined:Nov 2005	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:44:36 AM Ignore speedraider Report Abuse ok
Rick01 Champion Author Utah Posts:9,003 Points:2,359,650 Joined:Sep 2005	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:43:20 AM Ignore Rick01 Report Abuse Wall Street will find a way to keep a lid on it.
ruca2012 Champion Author San Diego Posts:1,049 Points:210,265 Joined:Oct 2012	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:42:30 AM Ignore ruca2012 Report Abuse oh well
mitchells Champion Author Montreal Posts:3,851 Points:1,122,310 Joined:Oct 2009	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:42:14 AM Ignore mitchells Report Abuse I LOVE my Geothermal system at my house, nothing located outside, no noise like an air sourced heat pump, and it works all summer and winter (doesn't stop working when the temps drop below -8C). It also works much more efficiently than an air sourced system. In Winter, the ground is always above freezing, so it can easily pull more heat out of the ground, compared to outside air temps, where as the temps fall, they become less efficient until -8C, when they stop working completely. In Summer, they are more efficient, because you're only trying to dump excess heat into the ground which is at about 15C, instead of trying to push heat out of the house when the outside temps are 30-40C, where the hotter it gets outside, the harder it is to push the heat outside, because of the temperature differences. Only thing these people need to realize, is even with geothermal systems avoiding outside damage, it still doesn't work without electricity.
Legend1500 All-Star Author Midland Odessa Posts:964 Points:567,375 Joined:Jun 2011	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:42:05 AM Ignore Legend1500 Report Abuse Interesting concept
scrossi Champion Author Indiana Posts:3,869 Points:1,045,565 Joined:Dec 2008	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:41:48 AM Ignore scrossi Report Abuse Time will tell.
bluebird1 Champion Author Toronto Posts:15,720 Points:3,105,200 Joined:May 2004	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:41:07 AM Ignore bluebird1 Report Abuse Its a good point in favor of Geothermal(except its still driven by electrictiy - ie. a heat pump) that I've never seen or considered. Still the damage from storm/fire/flood would be minimal. Also, had'nt heard of oil tanks issue from Sandy either other than extremely washed out areas. ...and to many posters like Jammer asking 'what does it have to do with fuel prices' - It's obvious, if use less fuel for heating/cooling (yes there's electricity generated with the stuff too) then should leave more for transportation, which should help prices. If only we can solve the paper bbl/gal. stranglehold & get back to physical supply/demand changing prices.
mnbeancounter Champion Author Minnesota Posts:4,718 Points:1,059,890 Joined:Oct 2009	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:41:04 AM Ignore mnbeancounter Report Abuse good news
GGAlbo Champion Author Detroit Posts:2,242 Points:1,882,580 Joined:Sep 2006	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:40:55 AM Ignore GGAlbo Report Abuse I like to see more geothermal energy!
Don20 Champion Author Oklahoma City Posts:9,657 Points:2,616,705 Joined:Mar 2005	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:40:20 AM Ignore Don20 Report Abuse I will bet another Sandy, will screw that system up also. You can't mess with mother nature.. Its like tornados, you live with it or move..
CorvairHaven Champion Author Cleveland Posts:4,344 Points:1,451,140 Joined:Sep 2008	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:40:15 AM Ignore CorvairHaven Report Abuse Stormproof? I don't think so.
Tiernan2012 Champion Author Sacramento Posts:1,078 Points:173,175 Joined:Oct 2012	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:40:14 AM Ignore Tiernan2012 Report Abuse Nothing is completely storm proof. Geothermal could be a slightly more secure alternative, but costs need to be considered as well.
kulwicki7 All-Star Author Virginia Posts:638 Points:268,845 Joined:Sep 2005	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:40:01 AM Ignore kulwicki7 Report Abuse finally geothermal is being taken seriously!
Chinto12 Champion Author Illinois Posts:1,019 Points:407,060 Joined:Jan 2012	Message Posted: Nov 9, 2012 9:39:07 AM Ignore Chinto12 Report Abuse apples and oranges